Classic Rounds with Classic Gear on Classic Tracks

Re: Classic Rounds with Classic Gear on Classic Tracks

Postby stevemcgee99 » Wed Mar 25, 2015 6:23 pm

I'm definitely going to have to get to Monte Rio (I've played San Geronimo once - it was a lot of fun) to play Northwood - if it's open to the public.

And Sea Ranch - went to a wedding there years ago and it would be great to go back with some clubs!

I'm going to return to Lincoln Park tomorrow, my second time there. I played New Year's Day this year, and had some of my better holes - and a couple of my worst thanks to greens where the ball rolls right off... First time I used the 1951 M23 clubs, which I found I could hit straighter than the stiff-shafted AT2W keyhole Macs.

I pretty much only play classic tracks, since they tend to be cheaper (even more so with the City resident card I got yesterday). And I only play with classic gear. Not sure if I've ever played a classic round, though!
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Re: Classic Rounds with Classic Gear on Classic Tracks

Postby stevemcgee99 » Thu Mar 26, 2015 8:51 pm

Man I had written a full description of the day but my file was rejected... GRRRR. :evil:


Anyway, had two great holes with fairway woods giving me GIR and Lincoln Park in San Francisco.

The 5th hole, drove to the first 'platform' by a white post that's probably the 150 marker. 4 wood to bounce on the fringe and roll onto the green.

18th hole 200 yard drive, nice and down the middle. Perfect lie on spongy grass so I went with it using my 2 wood. Carried over the lump in front of the green, rolled to rest against the back fringe.

Both took three putts (standard of the day for me, 9 total).

I did have a couple good putts, but mostly blah. Irons were not very great today, shorter was better.

It's an awesome course, though. Now that I finally have a resident card I'll be going there a lot.
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5th hole green, my ball resting in front.
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Re: Classic Rounds with Classic Gear on Classic Tracks

Postby norcalvol » Sun Apr 26, 2015 6:55 pm

I played a classic track on Saturday... but for the first time in 13 months, I played with metal woods, including a driver of the very large head size variety (Ping G20).

I did this as an experiment because I hadn't hit such clubs since becoming an ABS student.

For background/disclosure --- I'm nearly 60 years old, so I grew up playing persimmons... but because I quit the game essentially for over 20 years (with a 2-year return in the middle) and came back to it only two years ago, the progression of equipment changes didn't come into my personal experience. It was more like a cold-water shock. I give this background because this experience is perhaps akin to leaving society for many years and then coming back to see the age of the internet, etc.

Observations...

The ball flight sucks. It goes waaaaaay up in the air and comes straight down. Perhaps this is partly a function of my swing --- perhaps ---- but why does a giant metal head of 10 degrees loft send the ball so high when I hit a 9 degree persimmon so much lower? One degree difference makes that much of a difference in ball flight? Is it the weight distribution in the head? Whatever it is, I simply don't like it. At all.

Impact has a dead feeling. It is very difficult to describe other than to describe it as dead. There is no 'life' to it. There is no sensual pleasure. And the sound actually registers in my ears as an unpleasant feeling when I hit it. That doesn't happen when a playing partner hits one, but it does when I hit one.

The feel of the club on the downswing is, for lack of a better word, uncomfortable. This was the aspect of the experiment that was the most surprising. Here we have a rather light club of fairly low SW (D0), but compared to hitting a much heavier persimmon, swinging the big metal felt like I was in some kind of wrestling match. My mental visual is being underwater and swinging a metal rod with a large balloon on the far end. There is some kind of weird physical resistance going on when trying to ge the metal driver through the impact zone. The bottom line: swinging a heavy persimmon is MUCH easier than swinging a modern large headed metal. I know, it sounds funny, but that's my take on it.

There is no difference in distance. In fact, my best persimmon strikes go FARTHER. The ball flight has a lot to do with this, I'm sure (high ball flight with no roll vs low ball flight with roll). Today, I GPS'd a drive I hit with my PowerBilt persimmon driver (I wanted to know because I crushed it): 275 yards (with roll, but it wasn't dry and the fairway grass was a bit hairy because of recent rain). I know it was much further than my average persimmon driver distance, but I'm pretty sure that I do not, on average, hit a metal farther than I hit a persimmon.

I will say that hitting a 3-wood metal has some good feel to it --- and, it is MUCH easier than hitting the big driver... and when hitting off the ground is easier than hitting a persimmon 3 wood off the ground ... but hitting the big headed driver is simply miserable --- ball flight, impact feel, downswing feel, and yes, even the sound. And all for no measurable increase in distance and quite a bit of loss of control/feel.

So those are my observations and thoughts from this weekend's experiment. In some areas I'm not too surprised, but in other areas I'm very surprised at the negative level of experience.

I'd be interested in others' observations that perhaps also didn't go through the entirety of the 20-years of equipment changes since the early/mid 1990s.
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Re: Classic Rounds with Classic Gear on Classic Tracks

Postby HelterSkelter » Sun Apr 26, 2015 11:58 pm

I used a modern driver over the winter after just using persimmon ever since I started with Bradley. My course was so wet this winter, I lost a lot of distance with the persimmon and the modern driver carry helped me. Probably not so much difference during the summer though. I never had any issue (from a classical point of view) with modern gear other than the fact that I couldn't hit it! So I had no issue switching to blades and persimmon and did it immediately.

What you say about the loft and height of the ball flight is very true and it's not just down to the internal weighting. I read up on it and it seems that most driver manufacturers put a lot more loft on the face than is marked. Ping and Taylormade might be two of the most exaggerated. So a 10 is probably at least a 13. To add to this the roll of the face gives more loft higher up the face so this 13 is probably at least 15 where you contact the ball.

I have found a couple of things with hitting a modern driver over the last few months, now that I have a better swing to try it out with. The first is that it is very difficult to draw compared to my other clubs. It seems very easy to push out to the right. The second is that it's a lot easier on the mind when you have to carry the ball a certain distance, you rarely lose distance - it's just a question of direction.

I will probably go back to persimmon over the summer, but it's been interesting to me to see the differences.
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Re: Classic Rounds with Classic Gear on Classic Tracks

Postby k2baloo » Sun Jul 24, 2016 2:44 pm

Lag,
Is this the Mare you play often and have talked about? http://www.mareislandgolfclub.com/

I assumed golf in SF would be pricey... I need to make my way out there one day as I know there's a bunch of you persimmon nuts out in CA. No one I've met plays vintage stuff. It doesn't bother me one bit, but it would be nice to find ppl interested in persimmon outings. Looked up Lincoln Park too; there are some cool courses out there near the bay.
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Re: Classic Rounds with Classic Gear on Classic Tracks

Postby stevemcgee99 » Mon Jul 25, 2016 7:02 pm

I've paid $9 for for Tilden Park and Lake Chabot.
Usually pay $20 or so afternoons at Sharp Park (love it), Lincoln, Mare Island, Palo Alto, or the first two mentioned.

I almost never pay more than $50. Metropolitan, Chrystal Springs, Presidio, Indian Valley, San Geronimo - so many great, inexpensive courses in the area.
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Re: Classic Rounds with Classic Gear on Classic Tracks

Postby stevemcgee99 » Mon Jul 25, 2016 7:03 pm

k2baloo wrote: it would be nice to find ppl interested in persimmon outings.

Absolutely.
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Re: Classic Rounds with Classic Gear on Classic Tracks

Postby Steve P » Mon Jul 25, 2016 8:39 pm

I was shocked a couple years ago how low the flight is on an m85 compared to modern. Lower more laser like. I can hit both accurate. I just remember to choke up 2-3 inches on my Ping. 45 inches or more is IMO way too long. In fact through my modern set I choke up on almost everything and like it better especially my seventeen and 23 degree hybrids.
The seventeen is my modern two iron.
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Re: Classic Rounds with Classic Gear on Classic Tracks

Postby k2baloo » Tue Jul 26, 2016 4:32 am

Steve P wrote:I was shocked a couple years ago how low the flight is on an m85 compared to modern. Lower more laser like. I can hit both accurate. I just remember to choke up 2-3 inches on my Ping. 45 inches or more is IMO way too long. In fact through my modern set I choke up on almost everything and like it better especially my seventeen and 23 degree hybrids.
The seventeen is my modern two iron.


I hit my dynapowers with a peak height around 80 feet while modern irons I average a peak height just around 100 or just a touch over. Definitely a different flight. I don't have M85s yet, but will have to pick up a set eventually. I wouldn't be surprised if they're even lower since that is a 50's iron.
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Re: Classic Rounds with Classic Gear on Classic Tracks

Postby norcalvol » Tue Jul 26, 2016 11:21 am

k2baloo wrote:I hit my dynapowers with a peak height around 80 feet while modern irons I average a peak height just around 100 or just a touch over. Definitely a different flight. I don't have M85s yet, but will have to pick up a set eventually. I wouldn't be surprised if they're even lower since that is a 50's iron.


How do the shafts influence this? I would think more than just the make/model/age.
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