The Ben Hogan Golf Swing

Re: The Ben Hogan Golf Swing

Postby Hogansearcher » Sat Jan 05, 2019 6:17 pm

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Re: The Ben Hogan Golf Swing

Postby Gabriel_Knight » Sun Jan 06, 2019 1:47 am

Hogansearcher wrote:
Gabriel_Knight wrote:What Hogan did or did not mention in his books reminds me of the following story:

“this little move is so important that Saito Sensei didnt mention it in his book”. He said that frequently!


Do you think that was because what he was saying was assumed to be so obvious?

Lag, I also wanted to ask you what you think about Hogan's grip and how that applies to his backswing in particular.



I think Seito Sensei simply didnt want the wide public to know. Or maybe his books would have to become 1,000-page bibles to cover everything properly.... In any case, for certain techniques he didn’t mention key details in his books and only taught such details at his dojo. They were subtle, barely visible things (grips, weight shifts, foot pressures, etc...), but significant for proper technique execution. To draw a comparison, if Lag taught us everythng except module 5, which covers hand attitudes (pressures and wrist suppleness - all invisible), then the ABS program wouldnt do us much good, except for the few lucky ones who would work it out by themselves.
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Re: The Ben Hogan Golf Swing

Postby lagpressure » Sun Jan 06, 2019 5:18 pm

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Regarding Hogan's grip, I suppose most Hoganites probably have the image on the left more in their mind. Five Lessons showed the right hand very weak and on top of the club. I've seen many players adopt that very weak right hand grip as "The Hogan Grip".

However, in viewing Hogan films, I see his grip much more neutral in nature. Probably about 20 degrees "stronger" than the weak right hand grip most visualize he used.

The weaker the grip, the more range of motion one can get out of their forearm rotation, so this is good. The downside is that if the grip is in fact this weak, the player will lose significant support through the strike.... so there is a trade off. I think Hogan's grip on the right was slightly strong with the left hand and very neutral in the right hand.

I don't think the actions of Hogan's swing movements work as well with double strong or double weak. I like where his grip is on the right picture.

His grip was more in his fingers than his palms. This also increases range of motion.

Hogan also had the shaft working more under the left hand heel pad than across it. This would make sense for a player that was not as tall as most of his competitors. This decreases the range of motion in his vertical wristcock, but he certainly had more range of motion in his vertical wristcock than most people would by his genetic nature.
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Re: The Ben Hogan Golf Swing

Postby Hogansearcher » Tue Jan 08, 2019 9:18 am

Lag,

I have been reviewing a lot of Mr Hogan's videos since your post, and I think you are correct. His grip with the right hand is not as weak as I was led to believe.

Back to the drawing board!
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Re: The Ben Hogan Golf Swing

Postby fontaine32 » Wed Jan 09, 2019 1:15 pm

Ben Hogan completely revamped his game in one day if you listen to his interviews. Unlike the article says earlier, it happened right around 1940. Whether he changed his setup/aim or his swing first then adjusted, I have no idea.
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Re: The Ben Hogan Golf Swing

Postby LesMurray » Wed Jan 09, 2019 3:57 pm

fontaine32 wrote:Ben Hogan completely revamped his game in one day if you listen to his interviews. Unlike the article says earlier, it happened right around 1940. Whether he changed his setup/aim or his swing first then adjusted, I have no idea.


I would say he made an adjustment that led to his revamping the swing. My guess is it was the cupping of the left wrist probably combined with some setup adjustments that he could implement right away. I go with that because if you cup the left wrist and have the forearms rotated open coming into impact, the rotation of the right arm is limited and it is a lot harder to close the clubface through the strike.

If you're hooking the ball off the planet and suddenly find a way to keep the face open it would seem like the holy grail.
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Re: The Ben Hogan Golf Swing

Postby Paul C » Thu Jan 10, 2019 9:12 am

I was re-reading Tschetter's book and she wrote that when Hogan was working with her, he would tie a belt around here upper arms as she hit balls. She said he was quite insistent about it and did it himself. It's a great feeling to feel both elbows working close to each to the top and through impact. It doesn't mean one should feel cramped going back or not create some width.
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Re: The Ben Hogan Golf Swing

Postby LesMurray » Fri Jan 11, 2019 11:00 am

Paul C wrote:I was re-reading Tschetter's book and she wrote that when Hogan was working with her, he would tie a belt around here upper arms as she hit balls. She said he was quite insistent about it and did it himself. It's a great feeling to feel both elbows working close to each to the top and through impact. It doesn't mean one should feel cramped going back or not create some width.


Who is this Paul C gentleman, and more importantly, where has he been hiding these last couple of years?
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Re: The Ben Hogan Golf Swing

Postby Hogansearcher » Wed Jan 16, 2019 7:46 am

Lag,

Mr.Hogan's left arm was always very extended and ridged. As fast as he swung the club, do you think he was just super strong to do that?
It's an area I have always struggled with.

Thanks
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