Masters 2019...

Masters 2019...

Postby Ded2Journey » Wed Apr 10, 2019 5:55 pm

Well, girlfriend is out of town and I have access to the internet=bad combination.

Anywho, been watching a bit of the masters coverage this year. Seen the changes to hole 5...and found it very interesting. Enjoy!

"People have always been telling me what I can't do. I guess I have wanted to show them. That's been one of my driving forces all my life." -Ben Hogan
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Re: Masters 2019...

Postby LesMurray » Fri Apr 12, 2019 9:12 am

I watched the final round '75 Masters coverage Lag posted.

I miss those days.
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Re: Masters 2019...

Postby lagpressure » Sat Apr 13, 2019 5:00 pm

It was nice to see the absence of broomstick putters and great to see them putting with the pin in again. That was an old rule going back to the 1960's and before. It's correct for the game.

It's certainly a step in the right direction. First time I have seen any kind of step in the right direction in decades.

Now if they can address the distance and trajectory issues so the course plays correctly again, that would be the obvious next step.
Seeing the ball coming in so high and stopping on a dime makes it look like any other tour event.

When they start hitting 3 and 4 irons into 10 and 11, and the par 5's are actually big risk and reward situations to go for them in two with fairway woods or 2 irons, then I'll be interested in watching the event again.

I'm encouraged that they have adopted a lot from the TRGA Rule book. I have no doubt they downloaded it and reviewed it because it's just too uncanny.

Too much of a birdie fest. Majors should be single digit events at best and should feel different than a typical tour event. There is no sense of contemplative decision making that risks punishment vs reward.

The rain argument is common these days, but in the past rain meant the courses played really long.. and mid iron par 4's were suddenly long iron approaches. None of that is happening now. A major shouldn't need a "lack or rain" to be a major. The great thing about the classic game was that rain made the course longer and more difficult, and dry made the greens firmer and more difficult. If the course is set up correctly, you need weather to determine if it is going to play like a major.
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Re: Masters 2019...

Postby Ded2Journey » Sun Apr 14, 2019 4:56 am

lagpressure wrote:It was nice to see the absence of broomstick putters and great to see them putting with the pin in again. That was an old rule going back to the 1960's and before. It's correct for the game.

It's certainly a step in the right direction. First time I have seen any kind of step in the right direction in decades.

Now if they can address the distance and trajectory issues so the course plays correctly again, that would be the obvious next step.
Seeing the ball coming in so high and stopping on a dime makes it look like any other tour event.

When they start hitting 3 and 4 irons into 10 and 11, and the par 5's are actually big risk and reward situations to go for them in two with fairway woods or 2 irons, then I'll be interested in watching the event again.

I'm encouraged that they have adopted a lot from the TRGA Rule book. I have no doubt they downloaded it and reviewed it because it's just too uncanny.

Too much of a birdie fest. Majors should be single digit events at best and should feel different than a typical tour event. There is no sense of contemplative decision making that risks punishment vs reward.

The rain argument is common these days, but in the past rain meant the courses played really long.. and mid iron par 4's were suddenly long iron approaches. None of that is happening now. A major shouldn't need a "lack or rain" to be a major. The great thing about the classic game was that rain made the course longer and more difficult, and dry made the greens firmer and more difficult. If the course is set up correctly, you need weather to determine if it is going to play like a major.
"People have always been telling me what I can't do. I guess I have wanted to show them. That's been one of my driving forces all my life." -Ben Hogan
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Re: Masters 2019...

Postby lagpressure » Sun Apr 14, 2019 10:05 pm

I remember posting here quite a few years ago that I would not write Tiger off. I was quite sure he would have another great moment. The thing is, you don't forget how to win. He's had so much more experience winning than most of the younger guys combined. It must be really exciting for him and I was happy to hear he broke through with another exciting victory.

I didn't get to see the event as I was flying back from Hawaii today. My wife told me right before I got on the plane this morning "Tiger Won!" So wouldn't have been able to see it unfold. I'm sure it was exciting.

In the post interview, Tiger ran down all the clubs he hit into each green. It was a lot of 8 irons, a couple 7 irons and the longest iron he hit into a par 4 was on hole 5 where he hit a 5 iron. He said he hit 8 iron into 13 and I think a 6 iron into 15.

With the greens as soft as they were, those kind of trajectories don't require the advanced level of shotmaking a major championship should require.
I know I sound like a broken record every year around major time, but I actually feel more hopeful about the future of the game than I have for a long time.
Since they have smartened up with making some long overdue rule changes... and adopted much of the TRGA stuff, I can only hope that at some point they might start thinking about the relationship between course design...particularly the shape of the greens in relation to the different trajectories that the golf ball should be coming into the greens to bring back one of the most basic fundamental concepts of the great game.

As much as "The Masters" is beloved as the pinnacle of the game, the course is just playing like a regular tour event, and all the double digit under par onslaught just supports that.

But back to Tiger, from the highlight reel and the bit I saw of him yesterday, his golf swing looks about as good as I have ever seen it. I'm glad to see he got rid of all the "swing coaches" and just went back to feeling the game again more internally. It's the first time I have seen the softness in his wrist joints through transition in a very long time. I expect he will be winning more golf tournaments again.

Congrats to TIger!
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Re: Masters 2019...

Postby LesMurray » Mon Apr 15, 2019 6:56 am

I watched most of the tournament up to Tiger's birdie at 16. He was driving fairly well, though not exemplary. He did hit the fairways when it mattered most - 13, 14, 15, 17, 18. What I found impressive is how he is still working the ball much better than anyone else. On 15 he brought the ball in from the right and got the ball to release towards the hole. You just don't see anyone else doing this anymore. I want to say there were several other examples of this but I can't recall which days and holes.

Molinari surprised me with his mistakes at 12 and 15. Where he was automatic at the Open last year, this year, when it mattered most, he crumbled. It was his to win.
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Re: Masters 2019...

Postby lagpressure » Mon Apr 15, 2019 9:51 am

I probably mentioned this last year or the year before, but 16 does not play properly anymore. Hasn't for a very long time.

If the pin is down in the hole left, Sunday placement, you can get it close by shooting at the pin, a little right of the pin or way right of the pin and they all
can end with result, a short birdie putt.

Now if the green speed is slower like it used to be, the ball hit right stays right and the player has a tricky downhill putt. The only way to get the ball close on
Sunday in the old game was to take it right at the pin and bring the bunker and water into play. So you actually had a rick and reward situation.

Augusta just plays too typical now. Not nearly as much risk-reward situations as in the past. The par 5's coming in with low trajectory long irons or fairway woods exponentially increase the risk reward situation... and adds a real life element to the player AND the spectator.

I am not in any way trying to take away from Tiger's victory, my focus is just commentary on how the course is set up, the implementation of modern gear and how the course plays being set up totally in opposition to it's original intentions.

I think Tiger might have won by 10 shots here if it was played with the correct parameters as they were intended. As Les mentioned, Tiger is still shaping some shots.

They do still talk about Jones and tradition etc... and I know Tiger understands the classic game. I heard him mention in his interview "the modern game" so he is aware of the distinction between the two games. I get that it is noteworthy that he has "adapted"... but a chess player could "adapt" to being a checkers player similarly.
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Re: Masters 2019...

Postby Wknhacker » Mon Apr 15, 2019 11:57 am

I was really excited to see how some of the young promising players would use their long irons into the lengthened number 5. On Friday, I saw John Rahm hit is 5 iron about 30 yards right from the green. Wasn't even in the ball park. Using long irons into greens is as alien to the young guys as balata balls. I feel that number 16 has been reduced to a "hole in one" circus act instead of it being played the way John described above.

As for Tiger, it was great watching him play during that final round and drawing on all his experience to stay focused and patient. Definitely one of the great comeback stories in all of sport.
"I have a tip that can take five strokes off anyone's golf game: it's called an eraser." - Arnold Palmer
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Re: Masters 2019...

Postby Ded2Journey » Mon Apr 15, 2019 2:52 pm

Love the commentary and feedback everyone...that's why I enjoy this site so much.

Tiger's ability to win is undeniable...but now the pack is going to be hungry. I hope these guys can adjust, because he's only going to get better from here...hard to believe he's 43 too.

I was fortunate enough to watch almost every shot due to the Colorado weather, and the awesome masters.com website. I spent the mornings enjoying the morning on the range sessions too. Tiger knew he was going to win...he was so poised from the minute he stepped on the course, it was like watching a guru. Regardless of the clubs he hit, etc...he played some incredible golf--but that's what champions do, and that's what Tiger woods is.

To me, this is as compelling as MJ's comeback...which I'm sure every sports announcer is saying by now. That's the real story to me...what a narrative!
"People have always been telling me what I can't do. I guess I have wanted to show them. That's been one of my driving forces all my life." -Ben Hogan
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Re: Masters 2019...

Postby lagpressure » Mon Apr 15, 2019 7:16 pm

Wknhacker wrote:I was really excited to see how some of the young promising players would use their long irons into the lengthened number 5. On Friday, I saw John Rahm hit is 5 iron about 30 yards right from the green. Wasn't even in the ball park. Using long irons into greens is as alien to the young guys as balata balls. I feel that number 16 has been reduced to a "hole in one" circus act instead of it being played the way John described above.



Long irons are actually the 2,3,4 irons... and of course the rarer 1 iron.
A 5 iron is a mid iron... that would be 5,6,7 irons.
The short irons are 8,9 PW.

So they are not really hitting long irons at all from what I have been seeing...
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